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  • Fueling shootout - Comparing pump gas, E85, boost juice, methanol, MS109, C16, etc.

      • Fueling shootout - Comparing pump gas, E85, boost juice, methanol, MS109, C16, etc.

        Published on 09-19-2017 11:24 PM
        20 Comments Comments
        This is a great comparison from The Tuning School who tried out various fuels and provided great data. They compared 93 octane pump fuel, MS103, C9, E85, VP C85, MS109, leaded C16, 93 octane plus water, 93 plus boost juice, and 93 with methanol.


        The results are very interesting as VP's C85 ethanol race fuel provides the best results. However, 93 octane with methanol injection is right on its heels. This of course shows what a value methanol injection is:


        93 octane pump gas with methanol even tops MS109 race gas and C16 race gas. C16 is leaded and really outdated as a race fuel with modern direct injected motors and ethanol blends.

        Overall ethanol is the champ here. It is just a matter of availability for most people but if E85 is not available methanol injection is a nice alternative. Just keep in mind that supplemental methanol injection comes with its own pluses and minuses not to mention that methanol is highly corrosive and flammable. It also does not create the same taxing issues on a direct injected fuel system that straight E85 does.




        This article was originally published in forum thread: Fueling shootout - Comparing pump gas, E85, boost juice, methanol, MS109, C16, etc. started by Sticky View original post
        Comments 20 Comments
        1. AWSAWS's Avatar
          AWSAWS - 09-21-2017, 10:43 AM
          Ethanol isn't corrosive and flammable? Click here to enlarge

          Methanol is the best fuel hands down. If you can pump enough of it Click here to enlarge
        1. TwistedTuning's Avatar
          TwistedTuning - 09-21-2017, 11:25 AM
          this video highlights part of the reason, sometimes i recommend meth to my customers over E85.
        1. Sw4y1313's Avatar
          Sw4y1313 - 09-21-2017, 12:29 PM
          They say methanol is harder to find but up here in the Pac North West it's Ethanol. We have 3 places I'm the Tacoma area you can get meth anywhere from $5 to $7 a gallon. And your car only drinks it when you want it to. I just hope my next duty station has it as available as the PNW.
        1. Payam@BMS's Avatar
          Payam@BMS - 09-21-2017, 02:13 PM
          Thats why those pro mods just run straight methanol for fuel.
        1. AWSAWS's Avatar
          AWSAWS - 09-21-2017, 02:29 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
          Thats why those pro mods just run straight methanol for fuel.
          3.5:1 AFRs Click here to enlarge
        1. subaru335i's Avatar
          subaru335i - 09-21-2017, 03:49 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TwistedTuning Click here to enlarge
          this video highlights part of the reason, sometimes i recommend meth to my customers over E85.
          Methanol is a better fuel than ethanol for fuel but straight E85 is better and much safer than spraying a bit of meth on top of pump gas.

          Meth injection systems are not the safest thing in the world and E85 burns cooler than meth injected on 93.
          I would never recommend meth over E85 assuming E85 is available and you have the fuel system to support it. No way no how.
        1. Bob Loblaw's Avatar
          Bob Loblaw - 09-21-2017, 04:12 PM
          The C85 had the coolest ambient temp, but E85 had the highest average power and torque (more area under the curve). I think E85 would be no. 1 on this list and it's probably cheaper than the C85.
        1. Sticky's Avatar
          Sticky - 09-21-2017, 05:22 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw Click here to enlarge
          The C85 had the coolest ambient temp, but E85 had the highest average power and torque (more area under the curve). I think E85 would be no. 1 on this list and it's probably cheaper than the C85.
          C85 is the best way to go as it's consistent and blended race gas. E85 will vary but C85 is always the same blend for racing application.

          Ethanol based racing fuels are the way to go IMO.

          Meth is great but the main thing that scares me is if there is a hiccup in flow or some other issue.

          Either way multiple ways to go about it.
        1. MR747's Avatar
          MR747 - 09-21-2017, 06:39 PM
          very confused about straight meth? i always thought is was very flammable and could catch fire running straight meth in the meth tank thasts why they mix 50/50

          Is this wrong information?
        1. Sticky's Avatar
          Sticky - 09-21-2017, 06:41 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MR747 Click here to enlarge
          very confused about straight meth? i always thought is was very flammable and could catch fire running straight meth in the meth tank thasts why they mix 50/50

          Is this wrong information?
          No. Mixing in water is a bit safer.
        1. MR747's Avatar
          MR747 - 09-21-2017, 06:42 PM
          i am right in saying its very flammable?
        1. Sticky's Avatar
          Sticky - 09-21-2017, 06:43 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MR747 Click here to enlarge
          i am right in saying its very flammable?
          Yes.
        1. Sw4y1313's Avatar
          Sw4y1313 - 09-22-2017, 12:12 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MR747 Click here to enlarge
          very confused about straight meth? i always thought is was very flammable and could catch fire running straight meth in the meth tank thasts why they mix 50/50

          Is this wrong information?
          Comparing autoignition temps of gasoline (247–280 °C), ethanol (365 °C), and methanol (470 °C), methanol is the least likely to ignite on its own. Thats just my interpretation of your context of Flammable.
        1. Bowser330's Avatar
          Bowser330 - 09-22-2017, 12:36 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by subaru335i Click here to enlarge
          Methanol is a better fuel than ethanol for fuel but straight E85 is better and much safer than spraying a bit of meth on top of pump gas.

          Meth injection systems are not the safest thing in the world and E85 burns cooler than meth injected on 93.
          I would never recommend meth over E85 assuming E85 is available and you have the fuel system to support it. No way no how.
          What pumps do the promods use to inject Methanol? Do they use the same pumps that come with standard methanol injection kits?

          I have heard too many methanol pump failure stories to feel confident about running it. I read one thread saying to rebuild your methanol pump once a year....wtf? I didnt think a pump was as reliable as my windshield wipers.

          the risk trade off is not enough for me...the risk of a failed pump is a busted engine, if the fail safe software is not able to cut boost in time.

          Why doesn't anyone make a 100% approved Methanol Pump that lasts?
        1. lulz_m3's Avatar
          lulz_m3 - 09-22-2017, 01:11 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bowser330 Click here to enlarge
          What pumps do the promods use to inject Methanol? Do they use the same pumps that come with standard methanol injection kits?

          I have heard too many methanol pump failure stories to feel confident about running it. I read one thread saying to rebuild your methanol pump once a year....wtf? I didnt think a pump was as reliable as my windshield wipers.

          the risk trade off is not enough for me...the risk of a failed pump is a busted engine, if the fail safe software is not able to cut boost in time.

          Why doesn't anyone make a 100% approved Methanol Pump that lasts?
          The problem is going cheap with methanol injection. Buy an aquamist kit and never look back. I ran one on my 335 for 5 years without a single issue. Hell, never even did any maintenance although that's ill advised.
        1. Payam@BMS's Avatar
          Payam@BMS - 09-22-2017, 04:54 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
          The problem is going cheap with methanol injection. Buy an aquamist kit and never look back. I ran one on my 335 for 5 years without a single issue. Hell, never even did any maintenance although that's ill advised.
          Just FYI they all use Aquatec or Shurflo pumps and are just rebranded.
        1. Bowser330's Avatar
          Bowser330 - 09-22-2017, 05:14 PM
          good to hear an example of a maintenance free methanol system.

          why don't more people use fuel pumps rated for alcohol for methanol injection? Do you really need over 100psi for methanol injection?

          Is better atomization of the methanol with a 200psi water pump worth the risk of the pump failing?
        1. MR747's Avatar
          MR747 - 09-24-2017, 08:42 AM
          I run stage 2 snow Performance not tuned only use for cooling but scared to use just straight meth hence I use boost juice
        1. retired1's Avatar
          retired1 - 09-28-2017, 03:15 PM
          would have liked to see VP M1 results. Probably to much work for the fuel and ignition systems though.
        1. Sticky's Avatar
          Sticky - 09-28-2017, 08:08 PM
          Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by retired1 Click here to enlarge
          would have liked to see VP M1 results. Probably to much work for the fuel and ignition systems though.
          For those wondering, M1 is just straight VP racing methanol:

          Click here to enlarge